ასე ამბობს ბჰაგავანი

niu-iorkis mcxovrebis ubis wignakidan
(JurnalSi statia gamogzavnilia singapureli padmini iradis mier)
kiTxva: svami samyaro Zalian sastikia Cems mimarT.
baba: aseTia misi buneba. samyaros mizania imedgacrueba: man unda gamoiwvios moTxovnilebebi (ukmarisoba, ubedureba). roca ar aris sakmarisoba, adamiani eZebs ganxorcielebas.
kiTxva: … da xvdeba warumateblobas!
baba: roca eZebs ganxorcielebas ara TavisSi. TavisSi mas SeuZlia misi miReba. Sinagani xedva misawvdomia yovelTvis, is yovelTvis saimedoa. tkivili arsebobs mxolod im dromde, vidre aris mibmuloba garegan formasTan. sruli gaTavisufleba tkivilisgan SiZleba movides mxolod egos Tavidan mocilebis Sedegad – ganeitralebiT imis, rac erT raimeze reagirebs rogorc tkivili, xolo meoreze rogorc siamovneba, visi mexsiereba, visi ganpirobebulobac exmareba sixarulisa da mwuxarebis ormagi bunebis danaxvas.
kiTxva: magram es samyaro, svami…
baba: es samyaro aris tkivili. arafers amis garda arc elodoT am qveynisgan. amaSia Cemi neba: rom Tqveni ganpirobebuli arsebobis mTlianoba iyos tkivili; es saWiroa imisTvis, rom migizidoT Tqven Cemsken.
kiTxva: ukeTes SemTxvevaSi me SemiZlia mqondes mxolod ganxorcielebis miRwevis imedi.
baba: RmerTi ar elodeba arc imeds, arc imedgacruebas: es yvelaferi daqvemdebarebulia fardobiTobis Teorias. wuTisoflis yofiereba – aris rogorc imedis, aseve imedgacruebis, rogorc dajerebulobis aseve orWofobis miRma. man ar icis daskvnebSi meryeoba. is yovelTvis moZraobs yvela mimarTulebiT da amave dros maTgan arc erT mimarTulebaze.
kiTxva: maSin me romeli mimarTulebiT unda vimoZrao?
baba: is, rac mocemulia dReisTvis, aiReT dRes. is, rac mocemulia xvalisTvis, aiReT xval; icxovreT dRidan dRemde, yoveli momenti: warsulis gareSe, mogonebebis gareSe, logikuri msjelobis gareSe.
kiTxva: logikuri msjelobis gareSe?
baba: diax. logikuri msjelobebi boWavs, isini awveba gonebaze. axaldabadebuli bavSvi ar aris SezRuduli logikuri msjelobebiT. logikuri msjelobebi amoneben. adamianTa umravlesoba arian monebi logikuri msjelobebis, romlebSic isini moxvdnen.
kiTxva: maSasadame, me uari unda vTqva koncentraciis praqtikisgan?
baba: Tqven gaRelvebT gonebis fiqsirebis sakiTxi. Tqven cdilobT daafiqsiroT Tqveni azrebi da yuradReba sityvaze, Semdeg formaze, magram gaigeT, rom ar aris araferi mudmivi – yvelaferi ganicdis cvlilebas. magram geubnebiT Tqven: Secnobadoba rCeba ucvleli, maSinac ki roca qreba forma, maSinac ki roca inTqmeba sityva.
kiTxva: me vpoulob sirTules yuradRebis gasamaxvileblad formaze da sityvaze.
baba: radgan roca Tqven cdilobT meditirebas, TviT cda iwvevs konfliqts `warmateba-warumatebloba~. SeiZleba Tqven eubnebiT sakuTar Tavs: `kargia imeditiro amaze, da ara imaze~, an `meditireba amaze aris araswori da ugunureba~. akeTeT `arCevanis arqonis~ praqtika: araviTari sawinaaRmdego azrebi, araviTari ganzraxvebi – iyaviT Tavis Tavad. ar moeWidoT aranair gansakuTrebul formas, radgan isini Tanabar xarisxovnad aris is. ar CaeWidoT aranair sityvas an xmas, radgan yvela isini aris – is.
kiTxva: me xSirad magdeben urTierTsawinaaRmdego religiebs Soris.
baba: winaaRmdegobebi gardauvalia – amaSia TviT am samyaros da gonebis buneba, magram Tqven SegiZliaT aarCioT, gagtyorcnian usasrulod es moCvenebiTi winaaRmdegobebi Tu Tqven iqnebiT simSvideSi ciklonis centrSi. es aris problemebis problema, problema arsebobisa periferiaze Tu centrSi.
kiTxva: garsSemoweriloba Tu centri? borblis ferso Tu milisi?
baba: diax, centri aris simSvideSi; is myaria, uZravi, magram goneba, manebze gatacebuli obieqturi survilebiT, Sedegad daiwyebs Trevas talaxze da qvebze, qviSasa da eklebze. mas ar aqvs unari gaigos, rom netarebis miReba SeiZleba centridan, da ara garsSemowerilobidan, oRroCoRro gzis sirTuleebis gancdas daqvemdebarebis gareSe.
kiTxva: saboloo jamSi es niSnavs gonebaze gamarjvebas?
baba: iswavleT, yvela konfliqtebs warmoSobils gonebiT, misceT Tavis Tavad gaTamaSeba, rom daiyvanon erTmaneTi aryofnamde. iyaviT holokaustis mowmeebi. konfliqtis umaRlesi gadawyveta ar aris gadawyvetilebis miRebaSi da arc arCevanSi, aramed pasiurobis mdgomareobaSi yofnaSi: gabedeT gadawyvetilebis armiReba, xedeT usasrulo sirTuleebze, romlebSic Tqven SeyavxarT gonebas, rogorc RmerTis lilebs, mis TamaSs, rogorc bunebriv funqcias survilebis kvanZisa, romelsac ewodeba `goneba~; ar daemorCiloT mis mtkicebebs da madas. saxeldobr es urCie me svami abhedanandas. daakvirdiT gonebas manZilze, ar daaneboT sakuTar Tavs mis SfoTvebSi CarTva. maSin ukve arafers aRar eqneba mniSvneloba; da roca yvelaferi kargavs azrs, Tqven xvdebiT centrSi, sulier wonasworobaSi.
kiTxva: svami, Tqven xarT centri, mana da ferso.
baba: dae Tqven ar agaRelvoT, vin var me. ukeTesia gaiazreT, vin xarT Tqven da mudmivad rogor iyoT am WeSmaritebaSi. ar iyoT gonebis usasrulo xrikebis yurmoWrili mona, Tavi aarideT yvelafers, rac migaswrafebT Tqven mis badeSi. me wagiyvanT Tqven, Tu Tqven me momendobiT. Tqven ar mogitanT bednierebas is, rasac gTavazobT es samyaro, radgan goneba, dawyrulebuli alternativebiT, – es aris mxolod auxdeneli iluzia, warmavali Tqveni xedvis win. me ar gangsjiT Tqven imis gamo, rac sinamdvileSi Tqven ar gekuTvniT. Tqveni arasrulyofileba ar aris CemTvis winaaRmdegoba.
kiTxva: vaRiareb, me yovelTvis ar vicav qcevis wesebs.
baba: Tqveni goneba yovelTvis iTxovs `wesebs~, magram roca Tqven gaqvT wesebi, aRmoCndeba, rom Tqven ar SegiZliaT maTi Sesruleba. wesebi badeben sixistes, Zalis gamoyenebas. isini ar gamodian siyvarulisgan da ar moaqvT siyvaruli. yovelTvis aris SesaZlebloba gakeTdes raime wesebis gareSe. rogorc xedavT me ver Semexeba Tqveni aRelvebebi!
kiTxva: me mousvenari var, baba, viswrafi simSvidisken, me ar SemiZlia misi povna.
baba: Tqveni reaqcia SfoTvaze, da ara TviT SfoTva – ai ra aris cudi. mousvenroba – es aris mxolod talRis aRmarTva da vardna okeaneSi, romelic Tqven xarT. arafers ar aqvs mniSvneloba… maradisobis mdinare yovelTvis miedineba umaRlesi nebis okeaneSi.
kiTxva: me kidev ramden xans viqnebi mowyvetili am nebidan?
baba: Tqven xarT am nebis natamali, ai ratom itanjebiT Tqven wyurviliT moZebnoT is, SeuerTdeT mas da am saxiT ipovoT ganxorcieleba da netareba. uTvalavi Taoba, Tqvenis CaTvliT, mimarTavda am samyaros nugeSisa da mxardaWerisTvis, raTa daeokebinaT es wyurvili; magram wyurvili maT jer kidev tanjavT.
kiTxva: aseT SemTxvevaSi, rogori unda iyos swori reaqcia am wuTisoflis yvela cdunebaze?
baba: miatoveT isini, arafers ar moeWidoT. iyaviT simSvideSi. darCiT gonebis `usaxlkarobaSi~ (adgilTan miubmelobaSi); fizikuri `usaxlkaroba~ ar mogitanT Tqven gamarjvebas. mravali sadhu (gandegili) moxvda sixarbis, Suris, siamayis da Zalauflebis Zebnis rgolebSi: isini ver moscildnen TavianT saxls, aaSenes sapyrobile Tavis irgvliv. me gamogiwerT `usaxlkarobas~ gonebis – goneba armyofi arsad.
kiTxva: da moxetiale yvelgan?
baba: araferi ar gamoricxoT. iyaviT yvelafris mowme. gamoricxva ar SeiZleba gagrZeldes. RmerTi aris yvelaferi. Tqveni SeSfoTeba warmoiqmneba gamonaklisidan: is, rac gamonaklisia, axdens zewolas im sferoze, saidanac is aris gamoklebuli. yvelaferi aris RmerTi, gana SeiZleba aiZulo RmerTi datovos misi samflobeloebi? Tqveni goneba akeTebs daskvnas, rom SeSfoTebis mizezi aris is, riTac is aris SeSfoTebuli mocemul momentSi. WeSmariti mizezi amaSi ar aris: Tqven zRudavT RmerTs Tqveni varaudebiT, ai aqedan aris SeSfoTeba; radgan Tqvenc RmrTiuri xarT, da Tqveni realoba protests acxadebs aseTi SezRudvis winaaRmdeg.
kiTxva: baba, zogjer me mowyenili var, rom me aseTi ucnauri var, rom me Cems CvevebSi ase ganvsxvavdebi sxvebisgan, vinc Camodis TqvenTan daxmarebisTvis.
baba: Tu Tqveni gza mTlianad gamoirCeva garSemo myofTagan, daijereT, rom es aris Cemi neba TqvenTvis. nebismieri gza – aris Cemi gza; da gza, romelic zogierT sadhaks (maZieblebs) eCveneba raionuli, SeiZleba aRmoCndes yvelaze pirdapiri. CemTvis ar aris `uimedo~ SemTxvevebi. akeTeT `arCevanis arqonis~ praqtika, rogorc me gamovwere zemoT. arCevanis gamouyeneblobas mihyavs myisier dakmayofilebasTan.
kiTxva: me mSlis Cemi gataceba Cais smiT.
baba: is, vinc svams Cais, ar erTmeva zecani. rajasiki adamiani xdeba uzomod aqtiuri Caisgan, magram invalidisTvis is iZleva aucilebel amaRlebas. magram ar gatacdeT CaiT, rogorc erTaderTi realobiT. rac Seexeba Cvevebs, romlebic damkvidrdnen TqvenSi, aq aris ori meTodi, romlebis daxmarebiTac Tqven SegiZliaT maTi Tavidan acileba. pirveli – es aris uari, uaryofa. magram aman SeiZleba moitanos mxolod droebiTi warmateba: roca gadamWreloba sustdeba, Cveva kvlav brundeba ukan da Znelia misTvis winaaRmdegobis gaweva. meore meTodi – ise gatacde raime ufro sasiamovnoTi, rom Cveva gadavardes TavisTavad. gaxsovdeT: imas, rac aramudmivia – ar aqvs araviTari mniSvneloba; mniSvnelovania is, rac mudmivia. Cemi receptebi sxvadasxvagvaria, isini gansxvavdeba damokidebulebiT adamianisgan, misi donisgan, Tundac erTi da igive adamianis SemTxvevaSi. yvela recepti moqmedebs. dae adamianebi movidnen CemTan bhajanebis saSualebiT, jafis saSualebiT, meditirebis saSualebiT, mantrebis an tantrebis, an sevas (msaxurebis) saSualebiT – rogorc me winaswar ganvsazRvrav. TiToeuli mova CemTan, TiToeuli unda movides CemTan – gamonaklisi ar aris.
kiTxva: Cven imeds vamyarebT Tqvens wyalobaze, Cven gvwyuria is. dagvexmareT Cven SevicnoT is.
baba: arasdros me ar miTxovia TqvenTvis damimsaxuroT me. minda mxolod, rom me viyo TqvenTvis saWiro. Tqveni gza ar aris damsaxurebebis gza. gadmomeciT me mudmivad warmoqmnadi Tqveni gonebis survilebi yovel jer, roca isini Cndebian. isini me ver damaSokireben, radgan isini warmoiqmnen Cemi surviliT. momitaneT me Tqveni orWofoba, Tqveni SiSi, Tqveni survilebi, Tqveni gangaSebi, Tqveni uunaroba giyvardeT samyaro, Tqveni meryeoba imsaxuroT, Tqveni eWvianoba – yvela naklovaneba, romelic dgas Tqveni sadhanis (sulieri praqtikis) gzaze.
kiTxva: Cven SegviZlia vakeToT seva, Tu Cven vgrZnobT STagonebas amis keTebaze. magram Tu aseTi STagoneba ar arsebobs?
baba: arsebobs samyaros msaxurebis mravali gza. Tqven SegiZliaT emsaxuroT, Tu aqtiurad ara, maSin, ukidures SemTxvevaSi, Tqveni simSvidiT. yvelas ar sWirdeba mudmivad moqmedeba. Tqveni dasavleTis memkvidreoba pativs scems aqtiur muSaobas. magram Tu Tqveni natura ixreba simSvidisa da martoobisken, maSin miiReT es, rogorc TqvenTvis yvelaze ukeTesi. ar inanoT amis Sesaxeb. mxolod adamianebis mcire ricxvs SeuZlia datkbes simSvidiT da darCes simSvideSi. aseTia RmerTis neba. sxva SemTxvevaSi, rogor SeZlebda samyaro funqcionirebas? Tu Tqveni bedi simSvidea, maS gakadnierdiT iyoT aseTi. Tu Tqven xarT gandegili, maSin iyaviT gandegili, magram iyaviT gandegili CemTan. Tumca Tqven SeiZleba ar iyoT wmindani, magram Tqven mSvidad SegiZliaT iyoT araferi. dae TiToeuli iyos iseTi, rogoric aris, magram ar daiviwyos, Tavisi sawyisi da Tavisi realoba. aravin iqneboda imad, vinc is aris, Tu ar viqnebodi me.
kiTxva: me kidev bevri unda viswavlo.
baba: Tqven gindaT iswavloT CemTan? maS ase, Tu Tqven dakavebuli xarT Tqveni sxeulis saWiroebebiT: misi gadaadgilebis, cxovrebis da gamokvebis mzadebebiT, romelsac is moiTxovs, maSin dro gafrindeba SeumCnevlad. is studenti, romelic ar xarjavs dros, erTidan meore saklaso oTaxSi mudmivad gadasvliT, Seiswavlis ukeTesad da yvelaze swrafad; Cems klasSi Tqven gaigebT yvelafers, ris codnac gWirdebaT. me gangacdevinebT yofis yvela mdgomareobas, raTa Tqven SeiswavloT, yovel maTganSi yofnisas, imyofebodeT CemSi. CemTvis ar aris gadaulaxavi dabrkolebebi, CemTvis ar aris araferi, ris Tavidan acilebac SeuZlebelia, me var yvelanairi ganpirobebulobis miRma.
kiTxva: magram Tqven ase xSirad da ase xangrZlivad ar imyofebiT aSramSi.
baba: yovelTvis, nebismier dros, nebismier adgilze, – me var iq, sadac Tqven gWirdebiT. yvelaferi garegani ganicdis droisa da sivrcis, bunebis materialuri kanonebis SezRudvebs – Cemi garegani formac ki ar aris gamonaklisi: Tu Tqven gsurT aRiqvaT Cemi fizikuri forma, maSin is unda moxvdes Tqveni mxedvelobis farglebSi, ipoveT iseTi mdgomareoba, rom Tqven SeZloT misi danaxva. da maSinac ki, man SeiZleba ar SemogxedoT Tqven. magram me yvelganarsi var – me var yvela cocxal arsebaSi. maTSi Tqven SegiZliaT daminaxoT me nebismier dros da nebismier adgilze – da miiRoT darSani. is, rom garegani xedva arasakmarisia, – gamiznulia: is (garegani xedva) wamieri, warmavali, SemTxveviTi, – imisTvis, rom Tqven SeZloT Sinagani darSanis mowyureba da miaRwioT mas. Tu me periodulad gamogyofT Tqven Cemi saxisgan, es mxolod imisTvis, rom mogiyvanoT CemTan – Cems TqvenSi daswrebasTan. me vici, rom mxolod es gagacocxlebT Tqven da mogcemT Tqven Zalebs. Cemi aryofna arasdros ar iyo sayveduri an Tqvenze uaris Tqma. Tqven unda icodeT, rom es yvelaferi keTdeba Cems mier winaswardasaxulad. me yovelTvis msurs Tqveni CemTan dabruneba.
statia Jurnalidan `RmrTiuri siyvaruli~ #14